Nobunaga's Armor

[shikisoku]

Have you ever seen real Nobunaga's Yoroi?
I'm searching but I can't locate it.
Does it exsit?
_________________

[the_khan]

I think I read somewhere that the only thing they found of him after the incident at Honno-ji was his still functional helmet. Anyway, heres a pic of one of his armours (and a pic of a model which I just thought was cool:)


Image from 'The book of the samurai: the warrior class of japan' by Stephen Turnbull (PRC publishing) described as Nobunaga's armour, referencing it from 'Kenkun shrine, Kyoto under the auspices of Heibonsha'

[owari no utsuke]

I know there is some Nobunaga armor at Kenkun Jinja (Takeisao Shrine) located in Kyoto. The pic that the Khan posted is located at the shrine. The shrine also has the sword "samonji" that was once in the hands of Imagawa Yoshimoto. Nobunaga took full control of sword after the Battle of Okehazama.

Unfortunately, it seems that the armor is locked up. I always ask if I can take a peek at the armor or the sword.

The model is awesome!
_________________
You'll Never Walk Alone!

http://www.otsuke.blogspot.com

[owari no utsuke]

Khan,

The helemt you mentioned, is that the same one that is located at Soken-in Temple in Kiyosu? According to the flyer, the charred (from the Honnoji) helmet is on display.
_________________
You'll Never Walk Alone!

http://www.otsuke.blogspot.com

[the_khan]

[evalerio]

I wonder if anyone here would know. I have wondered if a namban gusoku worn by Oda Nobunaga actually survived to present day. That it is one of the namban gusoku owned by Tokugawa Ieyasu.

[owari no utsuke]

I know there is some nanban gusoku at the Gifu City Museum of History. I have only seen photos of it though. It has the Oda mon on the haidate. It might be a reproduction. I really do not know. A friend of mine who lives in Gifu told me that the armor is usually a special display item.
_________________
You'll Never Walk Alone!

http://www.otsuke.blogspot.com

[shikisoku]

[the_khan]

Well I guess it depends on how credible you need your source to be. That pic I posted up was from 'The book of the samurai: the warrior class of japan' and Turnbull described it as Nobunaga's armour, referencing it from 'Kenkun shrine, Kyoto under the auspices of Heibonsha'

If you can be bothered, you might want to try emailing the Kyoto National Museum and ask if this really was Nobunags:

http://www.kyohaku.go.jp/eng/syuzou/meihin/kin/item07.html

[Obenjo Kusanosuke]

[shikisoku]

http://www.kyohaku.go.jp/jp/syuzou/meihin/kin/item07.html

That's credible.
Thanks.
_________________

[the_khan]

Ok sorry, I didn't mean to step over the line. Ive put the reference in and I hope its ok now. But I do have a question though: why do you have to reference prints? For photographs that's fair enough, but I was under the impression that copyright was only valid for 70yrs, so when your dealing with a scan of a painting of Nobunaga painted in say 1634, I would have thought that was fair game.

Also, Im not having a go at you when I say this, because its a genuine question, But under what circumstances can I post up a pic without a clear reference attached to it?
I see a very negligible difference to what I did in this thread, to what you did in this thread with the akechi armour which was obviously scanned as well:

http://forums.samurai-archives.com/viewtopic.php?t=3581&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Im guessing you guys are just really sensitive to Turnbull because you've had some trouble in the past?

Oh, and sorry to shikisoku for hijacking your thread.

[Obenjo Kusanosuke]

Khan, no worries. We haven't had any issues with Dr. Turnbull on this regard. That's because we are generally careful regarding mentioning his works as a source when we "borrow" quotes, passages or images.

Regarding your question about prints, the rule is simple and think of it as a common sense reality check before you post it. Also, think of it like what would your teacher say if you were quoting things or inserting pictures in a report? Your teachers would also probably (and hopefully) demand that you properly list resources and footnote/endnote all quotes/images. If you scan an image out of a book or magazine, even if it is an image of a print that was made over 70 years ago, you need to list the source from which you scanned the image. If you copy the picture off of a website, such as a museum's, you should also credit the museum or the website where you got the image from. This way, you are covering your rear, as well as the SA's. Generally speaking though, museums aren't happy with people lifting images from their websites. They usually insist that you ask their permission before posting or using the image elsewhere. Just keep that in mind.

On the bright side of things regarding prints, there are royalty-free CDs out there with images of many woodblock prints. With those, you've got nothing to worry about. Also, if you actually own a copy of a print and scan or photograph it, that’s okay, too.
_________________

Heee heee! Shita iro! Shita iro! Here comes his lordship, Baka Tono!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rekishinotabi

[Obenjo Kusanosuke]

I was recently at the Gifu Museum of History and I didn't see any nanban armor on display that supposedly belonged to Nobunaga. I also bought the museum's catalog book and checked that as well to be sure, but no dice.
_________________

Heee heee! Shita iro! Shita iro! Here comes his lordship, Baka Tono!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rekishinotabi

[owari no utsuke]

Thanks Obenjo for the news. I do plan to make a trip back to the museum this year.
_________________
You'll Never Walk Alone!

http://www.otsuke.blogspot.com

[Tai]

how do you get picture or images to show in this box? I wanted to share some to see and all I get is the file location?
_________________
大将

[Tatsunoshi]

Click on the 'Img' box, then paste in the url of the photo (it has to be on a published webpage). Then click 'Img' again to close it. You can also also just type img with [] around it before the url and /img with [] around it after the url.

[Tai]

Permission give by Author Boris Petrov
[img]http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/download.php?id=8155 [/img]
and here is the Nanban

[img] http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/download.php?id=7852 [/img]
not sure if an image will show or a site connection, since I am only a rice farmer, this is a little beyond weaving Waraji.

Question on Nobunaga and his armour??? How many suits of armour would a Daimyo have in his armoury, suitable for use?
_________________
大将

[Tai]

My apologies, the pictures provided by Mr. Bedrosov, of Tokugawa's "Namban Gusoku" armour. did not show up as it should have.
[img]http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/download.php?id=7852 [/img] Now the armour should show up, when opened.
I hope the powers that be won't hold up my promotion from Rice Farmer because of this snafu.

Boris did not say which museum or private collection this was from. With armour like this, it is no wonder Ieyasu survived so many assassin attempts. My guess... Whether in Palanquin or atop a horse it would of been a tad uncomfortable to wear.
_________________
大将

[Tatsunoshi]

Unfortunately, the site itself blocks all efforts to link to it or display photos.

[Hiro Katsumoto]

Um I know I'll get flamed for this but there are a lot of sites where you can buy working reproduction of Nobunaga's armor and helmet. I know it isn't the real thing but still, it's his armor in a way.
_________________
I am Honored to meet you-Katsumoto; The Last Samurai.

[Kagemusha]

Tai.Here is your armour picture. When shoving pictures from other sites. It is good to use Imageshack.us or other image hosting site so you dont also use the bandwith of other sites by hotlinking their pictures. Thats the reason you cant directly hotlink pictures from certain sites.

[shikisoku]

Thanks Tai but the pictures have no authority to prove them belonged to Nobunaga.
_________________

[Joyu]